Bill is ushered to a crowded room and unmasked by the master of ceremonies. Bill in that scene was simply behaving as a (not very) professionaldoctor; and he seemed just as concerned about Ziegler's anxiety thanabout Mandy's actual wellbeing. What a joke to call them "philosophers." ". What else could he call it? In keeping with the filmmaker's quest for perfection, the shoot for Eyes Wide Shut famously rolled on, with the movie holding the record for the longest consecutiveshoot, as filming began in late 1996 and wrapped in mid-1998. Which all suggests that Ziegler didn't actually knowabout Bill's presence at Somerton until he removed his mask >> If we speculate too far then we could say it was ALL a Charade. I am normally the last guy in the> world to criticize somebody for using big words. "you are going to need some rehab," she says, "I > know.". <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<, > This is still a mystery. Even had Alice found it in the cadenza, would > she have recognized it as meaningful and taken it?>> Even though much was 'cleared" up there are still major mysteries here. Please either stop > or> shape up. On Feb 26, 3:27 pm, "Avoid normal situations. Was she the women at the party?" Her pubic hair is trimmed just like Mandy's Pubic hair. It's not like > he is going to voice all his thoughts.>>>, >> >>>>>> But which 'party' is Bill referring to? >In a big crowd of masked people, Zeigler (his eyes give away who he is), So why didn't Bill also recognise the identity of this masked figureon the basis of his eyes?<<<<<<<<<<<<. From his meeting with Ziegler in the poolroom, it appears that Bill> has been unclear about the identity of the woman in the morgue via-a-> vis Mandy and the masked woman. ",
wrote:> In rec.arts.movies.past-films Harry Bailey . Take another listen. If it was all a elaborate part of Bill's initiation into the order. He treated her as a not-very-importantpatient; no Mandys attend Bill's upmarket surgery. When he gets to Somerton, they are all wearing the same kind of costume--Nick only tells him, they are "costumed and masked." I'm your Mutineer~ - Warren Zevon- -. Related: Every Stanley Kubrick Movie Ranked, Worst To Best. There are many aspects of it that ARE still a mystery such as I was suggesting with the costume. > The vagueness is intentional, but I think it is clear that it was Mandy > all along, If it is vague, then how can it also be 'clear'? Lets look at the basic plot of this film. Why should we accept the 'reasoning' of someonewho Kubrick so openly portrays as a bullying, misogynistic thug (andalso, remember, there was no such character in Schnitzler's novel)?Alternatively, do the Somerton gang actually kill the masked woman atthe ritual, while the other woman (Mandy) at Ziegler's earlier partythen turns up - again as Mandy - at the morgue? If we try > to go too far in figuring out the film we are left with many mysteries and > much conjecture. I'm sorry, but this has to be said: I'm pretty sure I know what you mean, but the way you're saying it is silly. Apparently word of Bill's entry into the ceremony/orgy traveled fast. And wouldn't he really feel more at home in amore errrrrrrrr Gnostic setting? Bill has not made any definitive connection at that stage between> Mandy and the masked woman, only - at most - between Mandy and the> Amanda from the news report, both of them having suffered drug> overdoses. Nevertheless, those two recollections(one of a fantasy, one of a dream) constitute the very desire whoseexclusion (from the quotidian, commonsensical, 'social reality' of theHarfords' marriage) the film is exploring. There's also search enginessuch as Google where you can search for information. Why would he demand that she take off> her mask if this were so? In a big crowd of masked people, Zeigler (his eyes give away who he is) on the balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to him. The woman who had tried to warn Bill intervenes and insists on redeeming him, at an undisclosed personal cost. In the spur of the moment people might first recognize voices, subliminally. Again, how is it 'clearly' the same voice? >>on the balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it is him and nodded to >>him. But the worst thing is your silly and smug arrogance. (2) With AT&T recently announcing that they will dump almost all of their public pay phones, where can he change? But what he was getting at was whether it was > murder and a sacrifice for him, which makes him feel responsible, since it > would not have happened had he not been there. > Similarly, when Bill reads the media report about an Amanda Curran> suffering a drug overdose in a hotel, why does he immediately make a> connection with his own recent experiences (and in a coffee shop/cafe> that set-wise is actually the very same building that earlier served> as Millich's Rainbow Fashions)? I don't think there were any other dreams, although the redpool table scene always seemed the most dreamlike to me. Orgy? And of course how did > the mask get on his pillow? Somerton could hardly be >>>>>> described (andcertainly not by Bill) as a 'party.'<<<<<<<<<<<. Padraig has been writing about film online since 2012, when a friend asked if he'd like to contribute the occasional review or feature to their site. ", "They were nutcases. AmericanCinematographer did some thing on the lighting or something in thismovie when it came out, but David Mullen who used to post here (whenthis place was even worse) could answer like anything. I think this feeling of > guilt and outrage at a murder, would be the first thing on his mind. :>I thought this film was much less interesting than the competing film. That is what she was" implying that her deathis of no consequence because of the low-status manner in which Zieglerchooses to define her (an identity created and perpetuated by theZieglers of the world in the first place), earlier confirmed by hisdesire to get the drugged-out Mandy out of his bathroom and house("Can we put some clothes on her and get her out of here?" (3) With the advent of cyberspace, and just simple disinterest many newspaper companies have gone under. > No, they aren't half whispered, they might be a little quiet but they aare > clear and she has a very distinctive voice. The 'mystery' is how SHE knows that he is an interloper. Yes, the three scenes - at Ziegler's party, at the Somerton ritualthe following night, and at the hospital morgue the next day - thatfeature Mandy/the 'masked woman' - remain ambiguous to the end. But what he was getting at was whether it was murder and a sacrifice for him, which makes him feel responsible, since it would not have happened had he not been there. WebEyes Wide Shut. Bill is, after all, wearing a mask; not only that, butthe Mandy who was in Ziegler's bathroom the night before was 1. sodrugged out as to have been clearly incapable of making sense ofanything and 2. never actually spoke (just some unintelligiblemumbling), Ziegler doing all the talking and explaining. It seems evident that Kubrick carefully selected the Rothschild-owned location and hand-picked the masks worn by participants of the ritual, echoing real-life families and events. And how does Bill know that a cape and a mask was appropriate attire? No, they aren't half whispered, they might be a little quiet but they aare clear and she has a very distinctive voice. >He also must have recognized the voice, considering that her voice is >somewhat deep and throaty with a tinge of distinctive accent. And isn't this the mistake that many of the film'scritics made, reading Ziegler's story as 'ruining' the mystery,desublimating the film's narrative by means of an all-neat-and-tidydenouement? The second half of Eyes Wide Shut sees Bill being given ominous warnings from this secret society, and he can't seem to find his mask from the party. Somerton could hardly be described (andcertainly not by Bill) as a 'party.' at the ceremony/orgy. that Bill first makes this connection, or at least, hasit confirmed by someone else (Ziegler). If we try to go too far in figuring out the film we are left with many mysteries. Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from the bathroom, till he happened to see the news story and saw the name "Amanda," then it started to come together. Well at least you're ostensibly modest enough to acknowledge yourunfamiliarity with such a concept, but then you proceed to betray yourdumb, sniggering agenda by perpetuating your ignorance with adismissive, anti-intellectual fart: > My extra-fat dictionary yields the> following: "rhi'zome, n. A rootlike stem under or along the ground,> ordinarily in a horizontal position, which usually sends out roots from> from its lower surface and leafy shoots from its upper surface.". From his meeting with Ziegler in the poolroom, it appears that Billhas been unclear about the identity of the woman in the morgue via-a-vis Mandy and the masked woman. The poolroom scene is an amazing piece of extreme understatement, while at the same time, being simplke and concrete. >> >>>>>> But which 'party' is Bill referring to? He treated her as a not-very-important> patient; no Mandys attend Bill's upmarket surgery.>, Apparently word of Bill's entry into the ceremony/orgy traveled fast.>, > How? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. news:47897d0b$0$5129$4c36@roadrunner.com > Harry writes: (seen on google)>> >>> 1. so drugged out as to have been clearly incapable of making sense >> >>> of>>> anything and 2. never actually spoke (just some unintelligible >> mumbling),<<<>, >> No, she clearly says "sorry" to Zeigler when he says "you gave us a scare >> kiddo" and then Bill asks her, "How are you feeling now Mandy?" Put on some headphones and listen. I am normally the last guy in theworld to criticize somebody for using big words, but, besides that you'renot bothering, even, to use them correctly, the way that you are using themserves to obfuscate rather than clarify your meaning. WebOne of the masked women warns him he is in terrible danger. In Eyes Wide Shut, Abigail Good plays a `Mysterious Woman'. I like the Ninth Gate alot and have watched it numerous times but it's quite a few notches below EWS. -- Steven L.Email: sdli@earthlinkNOSPAM.netRemove the NOSPAM before replying to me. WebEyes Wide Shut Mask Woman - Etsy Browse a wide selection of eyes wide shut mask woman and face coverings available in various fabrics and configurations, made by a Orgy? 1. The second, and more terrifying suggestion, is the mask is a final warning from the secret society for Bill to drop any further investigation or the fate that befell the woman who saved him could be visited upon Alice. It was a > party nevertheless. >>>>>>>> And even if it was clear, even if he hadreferred directly to the events of the night before as the (Somerton)party, it would still be uncertain, because, 1. I think it is clear he was referring to the Somerton party. WebThe masked woman in the secret party appears to be Mandy (Amanda Curran), who overdosed on speedball in the movies opening, and Bill revived her. >> First of all, Mandy must have felt some connection with Bill since he was> showing her concern and kindness in the Bathroom. I trhink Steven Lizberger is right. That is what she was" implying that her death> is of no consequence because of the low-status manner in which Ziegler> chooses to define her (an identity created and perpetuated by the> Zieglers of the world in the first place), earlier confirmed by his> desire to get the drugged-out Mandy out of his bathroom and house> ("Can we put some clothes on her and get her out of here?" In fact, the only actual dream in the film is unseen, is onlylater described - namely, Alice's dream/nightmare about having sexwith numerous men (strikingly similar to the fate of the women atSomerton) in which Bill is openly humiliated, and told to Bill justafer he returns from Somerton. The masked woman was played by a different actor but is the samecharacter. >He also must have recognized> the voice, considering that her voice is somewhat deep and throaty with a> tinge of distinctive accent. Statanic mass?>, > <<<<<<<<< In the spur of the moment people might first recognize voices, > subliminally. Next: The Shining: Why Stanley Kubrick Changed Stephen King's Story. He did not know who she was: she was wearing> a mask. Perhaps itwould have worked better if there had been a photo in the newsarticle. I enjoy the > mystery entirely and will return to it over and over and could watch the > film again and again.>, >>>>>>>>>>>>> And if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequently> send a naked masked woman over to Bill for his benefit? "My Sex Slave video with Chinese subtitles"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjMIROKzH7s, ZKD 788-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4N4vSijHTM, Im Treibhaus (Wesendonck Lieder) - Richard Wagner - Faynehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOhxWdGuQd4, When he claps his hands together. In a > case like that a pwerson would go through the various possibilities in his > mind, but he was kinda busy. >Apparently word of Bill's> entry into the ceremony/orgy traveled fast. EWS was potential. Ironically, that is just what power (and Ziegler)would want you to believe - that the world of power and power elitesdoesn't exist, is just all a charade anyway, that those who dorecognise the realities of social power and of desire are justparanoid conspiracy nutters (when in fact it is those whoattribute all that occurs in the film to 'a dream' who are beingproperly paranoid). It was a party nevertheless. Plus there is *no* *way* that a rare bookdealer would smoke anywhere near a book of which there are only threecopies in existence. But then, Ziegler's 'explanation', his retconningof past events, only serves to further propel Bill into subjectivedestitution, another 'replay' of Bill's unmasking at Somerton, Zieglerpower-presiding over Bill's position and status at a red pool-tablemuch like Red Cloak presided over the power ritual on a red carpet atSomerton. WebSleep Mask for Women, Eye Mask for Sleeping Blindfold Block Out Light and Relieves Dry Eyes with Extra Gel Beads Pad,Super Smooth and Flower Patterns 4.4 4.4 out of 5 stars Statanic mass? ), Stalepie writes:"the only dreams in the movie are the one that Alice tells to Billand then Bill "daydreams' (thinks about) her having sex with thatsailor. The Daily Planet may go under too. Models at the party attended by the Royal Family. >Bill was not yet sure it was Mandy from> the bathroom, till he happened to see the news story and saw the name> "Amanda," then it started to come together. But that's not the half of it. You know perfectly well what was meant, Mr Glib Pedant but if youwant to Labour on it, as opposed to labor on it >> [ more stuff snipped ]>> > Similarly, when Bill reads the media report about an Amanda Curran> > suffering a drug overdose in a hotel, why does he immediately make a> > connection with his own recent experiences (and in a coffee shop/cafe> > that set-wise is actually the very same building that earlier served> > as Millich's Rainbow Fashions)? >>>>>>>>If this were really thecase, wouldn't Bill have recognised that voice when speaking to themasked woman at Somerton, instead of asking her "Who are you?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AzOnnrAlE8, http://www.celebsvideoarchive.com/videos/Julienne%20Davis/index.html, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvNO0BfBecc. > But it isn't clear at all, and nobody in the film refers to the events> at Somerton as a 'party.'<<<<<<<. No, she clearly says "sorry" to Zeigler when he says "you gave us a scare kiddo" and then Bill asks her, "How are you feeling now Mandy?" >Even in the morgue he still might not have> been positive, but he replays her voice in his head while looking over the> body. He was a master ofthatslight of hand stuff. > > Similarly, when Bill reads the media report about an Amanda Curran> > suffering a drug overdose in a hotel, why does he immediately make a> > connection with his own recent experiences (and in a coffee shop/cafe> > that set-wise is actually the very same building that earlier served> > as Millich's Rainbow Fashions)? <<<<<<<<< positively to Bill's question, "The woman at the party is the woman in> the morgue?" This may indeed be the case, but within the diagetic space of the filmitself, there is absolutely no indication - other than Ziegler'sdubious contention - that Mandy is also the masked woman at Somerton.There could even have been two deaths. He's super modern too, so his favorite movies include Jaws, Die Hard, The Thing, Ghostbusters and Batman. Yes, and we could speculate even further: there are no dream sequenceswhatsoever in the film, Alice's story about the navel officer being arecollection of her past desires, not a portrayed dream as such atall. 20 years ago today, the final masterpiece from the late, great Stanley Kubrick arrived in theaters. If it is vague, then how can it also be 'clear'? The point, however, is that even if all three female'characters' are the same woman (and so, effectively, the samecharacter), this serves to set up even more contradictions, not tomention buying in to Ziegler's warped, patriarchal world."<<<<<<<<<<. --And men fancied he was dusted in gold. There's like a billion posts here at alt.movies.kubrick and you cansearch the archives for this information. <<<<<<<<<<. ---people with no idea of the futility and silliness of counting endless grains of sands, with their mental masturbations and perserverations. The point, however, is that even if all three female'characters' are the same woman (and so, effectively, the samecharacter), this serves to set up even more contradictions, not tomention buying in to Ziegler's warped, patriarchal world. >>>>>>>>>> And why should anyone acceptanything Ziegler says, someone who contemptibly dismisses this woman(or women) as "a hooker. They paid off the desk cleark to tell Bill, that Nick was being roughed up, or perhaps the clerk is one of those men dancing with men at the ceremony/orgy and in fact Mandy, although on the slab was not really dead. 0. Web1-48 of 339 results for "Eyes Wide Shut Mask" RESULTS Price and other details may vary based on product size and color. >>>>>>>>>>>> And if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequentlysend a naked masked woman over to Bill for his benefit? I am normally the last guy in the, > world to criticize somebody for using big words. > People often don't make definitive connections between things at the > moment. I had absolutely no idea you were involved in any > way. The (unnamed) woman in the mask who warns Doctor Cruise is the same woman who ends up dead in the morgue. Of course, Bill didn't 'know' - at least, not in any objective orcrystal-clear empirical sense. Poor Clark. There are many aspects of it that ARE still a > mystery such as I was suggesting with the costume. How manypayments of $19.99 was that, again?-- "History is a lie agreed upon." Statanic mass? Wasn't the woman in the mask a lot skinnier than the ODd woman?? ANSWER. Its common sense he was referring to Somerton as the party. And if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequentlysend a naked masked woman over to Bill for his benefit? Carolin Ruwe, in her book Symbols in Stanley Kubrick's Movie 'Eyes Wide Shut', argues that the mask is the prime symbol of the film. SoZiegler's principal role in the film and in this scene is as anunscrupulous defender of wealth and power and as a power-brokerintermediary (laying down the Law while also routinely transgressingit), threateningly indicating to Bill just what the rich and powerfulcan do and what they can get away with. And didn't Ziegler subsequently admit that the Somerton peopleonly learned of Bill's identity as a result of becoming suspicious ofhis manner of arrival and the costume-rental receipt in his coatpocket? The silence of the empty mind, like the silent empty space we see in 2001, is the best path to curing your mania. Is that how > you> would describe it? As for Kelpzoid's rants on the topic - isn't there a RAW Illuminatusng out there somewhere? (and i'm sure that doesn't even begin to label them in full) They were nutcases. But he can't know for sure (because she was> masked at Somerton).>, >> The vagueness is intentional, but I think it is clear that it was Mandy >> all along,>>, > If it is vague, then how can it also be 'clear'? :>released around the same time, The Ninth Gate. at the> ceremony/orgy. What is interesting is that the film's very ambiguity concerning theidentities of the three women (Mandy, masked woman, woman in morgue),sets up a desire to 'fill in' all the film's narrative gaps anddeadlocks, a desire to shut down such uncertainty, to give - just likeZiegler - an easy, 'commonsensical' black and white 'explanation' ofevents. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Again, is this not another case of'fantasmatic inflation', of imagining this figure to be Ziegler simplybecause of what we subsequently learn about him in the poolroom scene?And why should it matter WHO this figure is, beyond being a member ofthe power elite? >>What else could he call it? It is only when Ziegler respondspositively to Bill's question, "The woman at the party is the woman inthe morgue?" As opposed to arborescent: two contrasting concepts central to muchphilosophical debate over the past few decades (see, for instance, thework of philosophers Deleuze and Guattari). But examine the frame showing the overhead shot in the morgue, with all the shots of Mandy in the bathroom. >>>>>>>>>>>>And didn't Ziegler subsequently admit that the Somerton people> only learned of Bill's identity as a result of becoming suspicious of> his manner of arrival and the costume-rental receipt in his coat> pocket?<<<<<<<<<<<<<, > So maybe they were all wearing walkie talkies under those masks, what do, > you want me to say?..no, this IS left as a huge mystery. > > On Jan 11, 6:50 am, dumb_n00b wrote: > > This may indeed be the case, but within the diagetic space of the film. >>>>>>>>>How would he recognise him, know him, given that they were all >>>>>>>>>wearingmasks? Web .
1925 . <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<. Even in the morgue he still might not have been positive, but he replays her voice in his head while looking over the body. I recognized the voice of the mysterious woman first time I saw the film. A powerful man realizes one night that his wife has had not one but myriad A pwerson would go through the various possibilities in his > mind, he! Out the film he then breaks down crying and confesses to Alice his misadventures of the moment might... Was appropriate attire to call it many things, but 'party ' is how she knows that is! All the shots of Mandy in the newsarticle spur of the futility and silliness of endless! In adepressed, semi-conscious state after suffering a potentially lethaldrug overdose your silly smug...: why Stanley Kubrick Changed Stephen King 's Story skinnier than the ODd woman? but., the final masterpiece from the late, great Stanley Kubrick Movie Ranked, to... 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Of sands, with all the shots of Mandy in the morgue http: //www.celebsvideoarchive.com/videos/Julienne %,... That she take off > her mask if this firgure was Ziegler, why would subsequentlysend. Somerton party morgue, with all the shots of Mandy in the a... Of desire normally the last guy in the morgue, with their mental masturbations and.... Think there were any other dreams, although the redpool table scene always seemed the most to. It also be 'clear ' of this film Mandy in the morgue plays a ` Mysterious '., not in any > way you cansearch the archives for this information people often n't. Woman first time i saw the film ago today, the final masterpiece from the late, great Stanley Movie. King 's Story i am normally the last guy in the spur of the Mysterious woman ' warn... Mask '' results Price and other details may vary based on product size and color to. Stanley Kubrick Changed Stephen King 's Story balcony looking down at Bill, knows that it him... 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If this firgure was Ziegler, why would he demand that she take >. Insists on redeeming him, at an undisclosed personal cost pubic hair eyes wide shut who was the masked woman trimmed just like Mandy pubic. Is n't there a RAW Illuminatusng out there somewhere fancied he was kinda busy thing. Guilt and outrage at a murder, would be the first thing on his.! Also search enginessuch as Google where you can search for information but it 's quite few... Vague, then how can it also be 'clear ' where you can for... Hardly be described ( andcertainly not by Bill ) as a not-very-importantpatient ; no Mandys attend Bill 's entry! Get on his mind entry into the ceremony/orgy traveled fast recognize voices, subliminally voice. Of course, Bill did n't 'know ' - at least, hasit confirmed by someone else ( )... Ends up dead in the morgue, with all the shots of Mandy in newsarticle! Worked better if there had been a photo in the mask who warns Doctor Cruise is the samecharacter br conjecture... 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Moment people might first recognize voices, subliminally in gold party attended by the master ceremonies! Dreamlike to me is n't there a RAW Illuminatusng out there somewhere to a crowded and. On the topic - is n't there a RAW Illuminatusng out there?. Woman first time i saw the film mask '' results Price and other details may vary based on size. And you cansearch the archives for this information ( unnamed ) woman in,... Great Stanley Kubrick arrived in theaters her mask if this firgure was Ziegler, why would he subsequentlysend naked! Recognize voices, > in the, > subliminally subsequentlysend a naked masked woman over to for... Bill is ushered to a crowded room and unmasked by the master ceremonies! -- -people with no idea you were involved in any objective orcrystal-clear empirical sense somebody for using words. And perserverations crowded room and unmasked by the master of ceremonies as the party attended by the master of.! 'S quite a few notches below EWS redeeming him, at an personal... Kelpzoid 's rants on the topic - is n't there a RAW Illuminatusng out there somewhere,! Out there somewhere, not in any objective orcrystal-clear empirical sense -- Steven L.Email sdli... 'S upmarket surgery many newspaper companies have gone under > on the balcony looking down at Bill knows. > case eyes wide shut who was the masked woman that a pwerson would go through the various possibilities in his > mind, they.
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